P0238

All your other probs if any.
Artermis
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Re: P0238

Post by Artermis »

Thanks for the image work Ian, this helps a lot.

The weather is supposed to be particularly treacherous at the weekend so I dont know if I'll have the chance but I'll try and back it up onto a ramp and see what lies beneath.

I checked again last night and definitely no messages on startup about additive being low or empty but I suppose that function may not exist on early and less complex vehicles, so I wont take that for granted. The above reads like it was designed to be a dealer only function, so it's possible it's hidden down in the depths of Planet and not designed to be accessed by us mere mortals.

The car is on 106k miles, so if they are reckoning on 80k kms serivce interval it should have either been sorted by now, or it's empty and not told anyone. The down side to having a vehicle with no history, I've no way of knowing.

Thanks all for collective knowledge. Taking a pressure washer to the DPF could be interesting. Still need to look whether it'll come out easy enough. Did you apply pressure in the direction of the gas flow or did you apply pressure in reverse to clean it out?
Ben. 2006 1.6 HDi Allure

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Capncol
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Re: P0238

Post by Capncol »

Thanks for that. Understand the re-gen process as have done forced re-gens before. Didn't realise eolys lowers combustion temp. Every day's a school day!!

One thing about the eolys fluid is that there is a min dosage amount and it is activated by opening fuel cap. It is possible to overdose by putting very small amounts of fuel in at a time (£5) I think min dosage is for something like 12lts. Not that it's a problem- Just wasteful
Cheers Col.


206cc 1.6ltr (Wifes toy)
Mercedes ML (workhorse)
Corvette C3 (my toy)

When requesting help of a technical nature, please give as much detail of the fault as possible along with details of exact model, engine size & type, gearbox, year, mileage, and any relevant work carried out to try to solve the problem to help us help you.
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Artermis
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Re: P0238

Post by Artermis »

For the commuting the wife does thankfully I dont think that will be an issue...

What might be an issue is the new problem the dam thing has - no dipped beam. Wife reports that on way to work, fine. Coming home from work they wouldn't function.

So who wants to bet whether I've been unlucky enough for both bulbs to have popped at once or whether the BSI / Comm2k has taken a poop :-)

They say these things come in threes, wagers on what's next?

Looks like I'll be having some 'quality' time with the 206 this weekend. Will report back with updates on findings soon as I can. Typical is frozen as hell out there too!!
Ben. 2006 1.6 HDi Allure

IanL
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Re: P0238

Post by IanL »

First check F9 and F10 in the engine compartment fusebox, says my SEDRE.

If that's ok, I would then try a BSI reboot.

I can't remember - is it possible to exercise the headlamps with Planet? If so, and they work, that would suggest the Com2000 as the problem. This is the expert for Com2000 repair.

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GrandadMonkey
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Re: P0238

Post by GrandadMonkey »

I would check the bulbs first. Eliminate the simplest probability.
Ron
"If it ain't broke don't fix it!"
Golf 1.5 Tsi Evo SE Nav Estate Atlantic Blue
Polo 1.0 SEL DSG Reef Blue (wife's)
(Previously owned a 2005 206CC 1.6 Allure Moonstone for 10 years)

Artermis
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Re: P0238

Post by Artermis »

Afternoon gents,

Had a good morning with the 206cc before I got rain / sleeted off the project. Some progress has been made too.

Let's start with the simple - the headlights.

Somehow the car had managed to blow one of it's sidelights and both of it's dipped beam bulbs. I'll be fairly sure something has caused them to blow, as I check them for her [the wife] religiously, even though she doesn't know it! I'd not looked at them in probably about a week but for all of them to go in such a short space of time is fishy to me. I can only guess that something spikes a voltage or current over the lights and blew them. It's got auto-lights so I wonder if voltage is unstable during the startup phase.

Either way, replaced both side lights and both dipped beams and all working OK. Figured I'd replace all with genuine BOSCH bulbs which ought to be decent quality. It had those cheap nasty 50% brighter style bulbs. 50% brighter than what who knows because they're rubbish.

I couldn't bare to leave the one sidelight without replacing as I hate to see cars with one nice white light and another faded old yellow one. And seeing as I removed the lamp units to make things easier (or even possible...) I figured might as well whilst down there.

Now to the Eolys fluid situation...

It has an Eolys tank!! I found it sat rear and centre just behind the fuel tank, right where you'd expect it to be really.

What I did - which I shouldnt have done - was remove the tank. From Col's earlier words and the research I'd done personally I was expecting to find an Eolys bag / bladder in a plastic casing. So I acted on the assumption I needed to remove the tank and replace the fluid bag with a new one.

Having removed the tank however I now realise it is exactly that, a sealed tank unit which does not need to be removed in order to fill. Whats more is one of the fluid pipes is a connected to an open port on the tank, so if you took that off it'd flow any contents straight out on top of you and/or your garage floor. Research suggests it's rather toxic stuff, so avoid doing this!

What I did find was that my tank is bone dry. I'd reckon it's been so for some time too.

What's interesting is that I've now completely disconnected it and removed it from the car and I've got no warnings occurred at all. Whether it'll give some kind of warning when my wife fills the tank and it tries to dose I don't know. For now I've wrapped the electrical plug and fluid line some rubber gloves and cable tied them up out the way whilst the tank is removed.

For the benefit of others I'll refer you to this video on YouTube of the refill procedure... The vehicle shown is a Pug 307 and so the tank location is different, but the tank on my car is identical to that shown in the video. The only difference is that my tank has a metal plate and securing metal band / strap across the bottom. I dont believe you'll need to remove the protective metal plate or strap in order to refill the tank if you use the method shown in the video.

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyEpmE5MfWs

Since I've accidentally removed all of my tank and protection - snapping many rusty old bolts along the way - I'll leave it removed until my planet arrives and I can order up some new fluid. The tank is filthy and the metal protective plate very rusty, so I'll take the opportunity to address this with a pressure washer and some hammerite whilst removed.

One last thing to add - the Eoly fluid tank is marked with a fluid scale, albeit hard to see when it's covered in grime as it's not printed, just stamped in the moulding. Top mark is 2.5L so it looks like the full tank takes a max of 3 litres.

Once I get my planet I can refill and reset the system and I'll probably get the wife to empty the tank so we can fill, dose with Eolys and force a regen to clean it up good and proper.
Ben. 2006 1.6 HDi Allure

Artermis
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Re: P0238

Post by Artermis »

OK - so I'm struggling a little bit as I'm finding it hard to identify the correct fluid with any certainty. It's suggested that there are different types of fluid, either Eolys 42 or Eolys 176, depending on the colour of the click fittings on the tank. I should have the green Eolys 176. When i search for any of this I find stuff for sale that calls itself both.

It looks like Eolys 176 has been discontinued and replaced by Infineum F7995. Likewise if I look for that I just find staff saying it's Eolys 42/176. Anyone any experience?
Citroen Service Bulletin wrote:Modification : Particle filter additive

CAUTION : This bulletin concerns only the filling of the rigid reservoir. This bulletin does not concern the replacement of soft pouches.
This development bulletin describes the changes to the factory-fitted particle filter additives and their impact on after-sales maintenance operations.

1. The new 3rd generation particle filter additives
Factory-fitted application between RPO 12110 and 12166 (According to vehicle).
Suppliers and brands :
RHODIA : EOLYS POWERFLEX
INFINEUM : F7995

2. Previous type of additive
Additive DPX 42 is still available and must be used for all servicing on vehicles that have DPX 42.
When stocks of additive EOLYS 176 run out, it will be replaced by the 3rd generation additives.
N.B. : From 15/07/2010 onwards: Additive EOLYS 176 will no longer be available to order from Replacement Parts.

3. Compatibility between additives
Additive DPX42 cannot be mixed with any other additive.
Additive EOLYS 176 can be mixed with additives EOLYS POWERFLEX and INFINEUM F7995.
Additives EOLYS POWERFLEX and INFINEUM F7995 cannot be mixed with each other.
N.B. : As the additive concentrations between EOLYS 176 and the two new additives are identical, there is no impact on the operating calibrations of the engine ECU.
CAUTION : It is not permissible to mix additives INFINEUM F7995 and Rhodia EOLYS POWERFLEX with each other.

4. Filling or topping up with additive
4.1. Identifying the type of additive present in the vehicle
CAUTION : Prior to any operation on the additive reservoir, it is necessary to identify the type of additive present in the vehicle.


Identification by RPO no.
RPO no. / Vehicle / Additive present
Prior to RPO No. 9492 / All types / DPX 42
Between 9492 and 12110 or 12166 depending on version / All types / EOLYS 176
From RPO number 12 116 / C6 / INFINEUM F7995
From RPO number 12 125 / C5 (X7) / INFINEUM F7995
From RPO number 12 152 / C8, DISPATCH / EOLYS POWERFLEX
From RPO number 12 166 / C4, CITROËN C4 PICASSO, BERLINGO (B9) / EOLYS POWERFLEX

CAUTION : The only clue is the colour of the clickfit union on the filler interface..

Identification by the colour of the click-on union on the filler interface
Colour of the clickfit Type of additive

Blue clickfit : EOLYS POWERFLEX

Green clickfit : EOLYS 176 or INFINIEUM F7995, (Depending on the vehicle’s date of production)

4.2. Rules for choice of additive for after-sales operations
N.B. : These rules only concern the filling of rigid reservoirs with particle filter additive.
Conversion chart for filling or topping-up operations
Additive present in vehicle / Colour of clickfit on filler / Additive to be used in all operations
DPX 42 / / DPX 42
EOLYS 176 / Green clickfit / EOLYS 176 - INFINEUM F7995
INFINEUM F7995 / Green clickfit / INFINEUM F7995
EOLYS POWERFLEX / Blue clickfit / EOLYS POWERFLEX

5. Identification and packaging of the particle filter additives
Type of additive / Cap colour in additive kit / part no PR / Packaging
EOLYS DPX 42 / White / 9979.95 - 9736.65 / 5 - 1 litre
EOLYS 176 / Green / 9736.86 - 9736.85 / 3 - 1 litre
INFINEUM F7995 / Green / 9736.97 - 9736.98 / 3 - 1 litre
EOLYS POWER FLEX / Light blue / 9736 A1 - 9736 A0 / 3 - 1 litre

N.B. : For any maintenance operation requiring filling of the rigid additive reservoir, it is essential to refer to the conversion chart for the colour coding between the clickfit union on the rigid reservoir filler interface and the cap colour in the 3rd generation additive kit.

6. Recommendations/precautions
CAUTION : It is not permissible to mix additives INFINEUM F7995 and Rhodia EOLYS POWERFLEX with each other.
If the additives should be reversed, the filter becomes clogged with particles.
Use these products exclusively ; any other product causes a mmalfunction of the filtration system.
Use clean additive only as any particles risk causing the additive injector to seize.
N.B. : The soft additive pouches have a Part No. and must be replaced with respect to that Part No..
Ben. 2006 1.6 HDi Allure

Artermis
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Re: P0238

Post by Artermis »

OK, looks like nobody knows. Not to worry.

From what I've been reading either infineum F7995 or powerflex can be used as both are a stronger / more effective potion designed to keep the DPF filters blockage free for even longer.

From what I've read the earlier eolys 42 or 176 were coupled with DPF cleaning schedule of about 100,000 miles, so you'd expect to have to wash your DPF out at this point. These later F7995 or powerflex are supposedly able to sustain your DPF up to around 150,000 miles before they need cleaning.

The only thing I can't do is mix powerflex and F7995 - so you have to run it on one or the other. If i wanted to switch to the other fluid, I'd have to drain the tank and put the other fluid in. It's not a case as you can never run the other fluid, just you cannot mix them in the tank.

There is, I believe, a third option - PAT Fluid. This is an aftermarket / third party alternative readily available through a lot of different outlets. It claims to be a suitable replacement for any of the eolys fluids and probably comes in cheaper at around £25 a litre. I can't comment on its effectiveness or suitability as I've not researched it at all - i'm still hoping to get the genuine Peugeot product.
Ben. 2006 1.6 HDi Allure

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Capncol
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Re: P0238

Post by Capncol »

To be honest, I have an account with Peugeot dealers, and I just give them the reg, and they send out the right stuff. Not the cheapest way, but what I save in time researching alternatives pays for the difference.

As I do this for a living, I probably have a different outlook,
I would never get anything done if every time I wanted a set of brake pads (for example) I trawled through ebay / online parts suppliers looking for cheaper or different alternatives- Then there is the time waiting for things to arrive which may not fit, or go faulty 6 months down the road. I would then have the hassle of trying to return / replace the items, so for me it's a lot less painless to pick the phone up and ring the local autofactors or main dealer for whatever I'm working on, and have it delivered within the hour. I know it will fit, and if there is a problem, I can easily get it replaced.

I may seek alternatives for my own vehicles if the dealer price is a bit steep, but that is in my time, not my customers
Cheers Col.


206cc 1.6ltr (Wifes toy)
Mercedes ML (workhorse)
Corvette C3 (my toy)

When requesting help of a technical nature, please give as much detail of the fault as possible along with details of exact model, engine size & type, gearbox, year, mileage, and any relevant work carried out to try to solve the problem to help us help you.
Better still, put the details in your signature.

Artermis
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Location: Grimsby, UK

Re: P0238

Post by Artermis »

And I suppose if you're an auto-tech then it's the customer paying the bill and not you haha It's fine, I'm a tight ass northerner :-)

I completely understand what you're saying. I've only got two vehicles to worry about, my Fiat Stilo Abarth and my wife's 206cc, so it doesn't pain me at all to sit and read into these things so I understand how better and best to take care of the cars I own. If you're looking after dozens of cars every week for work it's an entirely different ball game.

I've sourced some fluid at a reasonable price believe it or not from a breakers yard. Got a very near full tank out of a 407 I think it was and got it very cheap too. Some people may frown upon this method but it will get the job done. Truth be told my wife is eyeing a new job in the very near future back in the town where we live, so running a diesel wouldn't be sensible. She really wants to swap it for a 307cc in that lovely gold colour they do. So no point spending large sums on a car she has little intention of keeping at this point.

Annoyingly my lexia / planet has not arrived as expected. It should have been here weds / thurs last week according to eBay est. delivery date. I'm getting a little concerned but this has meant I've not been able to refit and regen the car over the weekend as I had hoped.
Ben. 2006 1.6 HDi Allure

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Capncol
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Re: P0238

Post by Capncol »

Artermis wrote:And I suppose if you're an auto-tech then it's the customer paying the bill and not you haha It's fine, I'm a tight ass northerner :-)
Yes it is the customer paying the bill. If I spent half my day checking out cheaper alternatives, I still have to account for, and charge for that time. It wouldn't be good business sense if it cost me, and therefore my customers more than the money saved, plus there is the time waiting for parts to arrive through the post. Most people want their vehicles fixed ASAP. (14 of my customers are mult-idrop parcel delivery owner/drivers) I'm also happy to fit parts supplied by customer (at their risk) Some of these "ebay specials" they supply have quite a failure rate, and I often end up doing the job twice.
This begs the question of whether I would have a lot of warranty comebacks (and loss of reputation) if I did go down the route of amazon/ebay/online parts, so I have stuck to supplying good quality OE equivalent parts from a good autofactor as first choice, and main dealer as second choice.
A lot of the autofactor parts I supply are the same as you would get from the dealer in anycase, just not in the dealers box, ie Bosch Valeo Delphi etc:

See, we are not all rip off merchants :D
Cheers Col.


206cc 1.6ltr (Wifes toy)
Mercedes ML (workhorse)
Corvette C3 (my toy)

When requesting help of a technical nature, please give as much detail of the fault as possible along with details of exact model, engine size & type, gearbox, year, mileage, and any relevant work carried out to try to solve the problem to help us help you.
Better still, put the details in your signature.

Artermis
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2016 2:18 pm
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Re: P0238

Post by Artermis »

No rip off merchants at all.

To be honest for a lot of the parts I need I just use eurocarparts anyway, as I'm generally time limited, and they're the only real supplier in town.

I know if I think I've got an issue, I can investigate it Saturday early morning and ECP will generally have the part I need either in stock or can have it to me by mid-afternoon and I'm on the road again by Monday, which is what I need. At least with them I know they'll carry decent enough branded stock and I often have a choice of manufacturer.

A bit like above I went out the way to get proper branded Bosch bulbs in the hope they'd fair better than some cheapy supermarket or eBay chinese lamps. Or that boost sensor I got when I was working on P0238. I could have got cheaper off internet but ECP had it in stock and I could have it the same day to keep the wife on the road. It's more expensive but it's a branded part and I can have it quicker, so I can value that.

I've done the cheapy eBay chinese parts thing before and have come to appreciate the quality in branded stuff, so at least I only do the job once haha

You're a rare one for fitting user supplied parts. I only know the one Alfa / Fiat specialist garage near me that will let me supply my own parts and that's purely because I get on very well with the guy that owns it and he trusts me. Normally even he has the no own supply rule. It used to annoy me when I was younger and even cheaper but I totally understand it these days.
Ben. 2006 1.6 HDi Allure