Car Cutting Out, Anti Pollution and Converter Warning

[Emme0810]

Help!
I have a 55 plate 206 1.6V 206cc, roughly 51000 mileage, had it for about two and a half years. It started by cutting out whenever I was slowing down (approaching traffic lights, slowing to turn round corners etc.) but it would always start back up again. So I continued driving the car. I spoke to my friend who is a mechanic and he suggested that it could be the fuel pump so he agreed to replace it for me.
Last night, the car suddenly started shuddering quite violently and stopped. Luckily enough, I managed to pull the car in off the road before I caused an accident! I tried starting the car back up and although it did start, it still shook really violently. Anti pollution and catalytic converter faults flashed up, and it's never done that before. I managed to drive the car back home (a 2 minute journey), but the car would not go over 20/25mph. I knew that I could have damaged the car, but where I broke down was not a nice area, and I could've gone back to find my car gone!
So I left the car overnight, phoned my friend and told him what happened and he is coming round today to replace the fuel pump for me. However, I decided to see if the car had got any better, but it's got worse if anything. It might start up, but not for long, maybe a second or two at best. I managed to rev it up but it still shakes, and then it wouldn't even start. The car would also lock itself but I could unlock it with the central locking.
Does anyone have any ideas what it could be? I'm thinking the fuel pump could be a good idea, and maybe clean out the fuel tank itself. I don't stick to a specific petrol station, I switch between Asda, Tesco and Esso. The last time I filled up was at Tesco on Saturday morning. I'm stressing out as I need my car for work, and I don't like to see my baby in pain!

[gazza82]

You might want to get your mechanic to check the fault codes stored in the car's computer. This may help him find the real reason. As your car is a 2005 a good EOBD compatible code reader should work. The connection is in the fuse box under the dash by your right knee (I'm assuming you are in the UK!)

If it is running but badly, it may not be the fuel pump but could be the spark plug coil pack ... but that is only a guess. Don't go swapping parts willy-nilly or you will just be out of pocket.

[Emme0810]

It's not even running now, it's just cuts out immediately I think he is brining a laptop with him (he said something about checking codes) but we were planning to change the fuel pump anyway as he thought that could be the reason why the car was cutting out in the first place. I had it in a garage before and they changed a sensor (not sure which one), and suggested cleaning out the throttle. However, they had had the car for two months, so I took it back! My friend is pretty good, he doesn't charge me as much as he should anyway:)
Thanks for your advice though, I shall update soon, he's coming at 2pm, so hopefully we will figure out what it wrong with it. I need my baby back!

[Capncol]

Hi Emme and welcome.
Gazza is giving you good advice.
It could be that whatever is giving you the problem now is a development of the original fault, so before replacing the fuel pump, check the codes as it may not be the pump and you will have wasted money on a pump you possibly don't need.
The pump is unlikely to cause your current problems, so sort those first.
Good luck and let us know what he finds

[Enright]

Also it would be worth putting your location in your profile. You may find one of us is near enough to be able to help. The best diagnostic tool to use on these is Peugeot Planet 2000. But if people don't know where you are then they're unlikely to offer.

[Emme0810]

I'm in Edinburgh.
Well, the mechanic called me back today, and he thinks it could be the camshaft because apparently the car makes a funny noise when he starts it up. I'm thinking of asking him to try and change the coil pack first, but I just do not know what to do. A cam shaft is really expensive! They said that they need to be sure, but that is their estimation.
So, should I even bother getting it fixed if it is the camshaft, and could it even be that? I've done a lot of research on here and I've not seen the camshaft being the problem anywhere. I trust the guy who runs the garage, but I want to be sure that the mechanic isn't just trying to get money from me. I'm at my wits end now, I can't afford a new car!

[Emme0810]

Update: My partner (who is friends with the mechanic) phoned up, and they are going to try to change the cambelt as it seems to jumped out of its place and may have caused some damage. I am completely clueless, and when I tried to ask my partner, I got yelled at and he stormed out so I'm hoping someone can explain it to me.
As far as I am aware, there is a belt which locks into place with 'teeth' (as they've been described briefly to me), and one part has jumped out which is why the car won't start. Can someone please explain to me if this could cause the car cutting out in the first place, and what kind of damage it could have caused? Once the car start jumping violently, I drove it for 5 mins to get it home, so if the belt had come out then, I don't think that I could've damaged it that much. However, if it has been out of place for a while and that it is why the car was cutting out, there could be subsequent damage. But I need help figuring it out, and I can't rely on my partner to tell me right now!

[Capncol]

Oh dear. Sorry to hear your woes both car & partner.

Firstly, before you do anything, if your mech suspects the cam timing you need to check that first.
Do not attempt to drive it until it's been checked because if you have got away with it, it may slip further and do damage.

There is no point in putting a coil pack or anything else on it until you do check the timing.

Next you need the codes read if the timing belt turns out to be OK.

A coil pack is around £50 from memory, and if you have simply guessed that it is the problem without getting the codes read that indicate it being the cause, you will have wasted your money if it turns out to be something else, because once fitted (or seal on packaging broken in some cases), you cannot return it.
There are many things (including the cam belt slipping) that can cause antipollution faults and similar issues to yours. The fault codes tell you what the car is seeing wrong with itself.
There is a better explanation here

I will now try and explain your cam belt issues.
Look at the pic below.



The grey thing at the bottom with a semicircular shape attached to it going round and round is the crankshaft.
The green rod that goes round with it and pushes the piston up & down is the con rod (it's a bit like you peddling a bicycle)
Above the piston at a slight angle left and right you can see the valves opening and closing (these are operated by the egg shaped shafts at the very top that you can see turning.
Those shafts are your camshafts.
You will notice both valves are closed (up position) whenever the piston is at the top
If you look closely, you will see that if one of the valves is open (down) when the piston comes up to the top it would hit it, so the timings of these events are critical.
The camshafts are driven from the crankshaft by a cam belt, sometimes called a timing belt. As you rightly say it is toothed, this is so it can't slip (a bit like a bicycle chain)

When the belts get old they can stretch and jump a tooth or two, break, or strip the teeth off, so all manufacturers give a recommended age or mileage that they should be changed at.

If you are lucky, it might have slipped a tooth and not done any physical damage. If you are unlucky the valve mentioned above could have collided with the piston and bent, and that is an expensive repair.
The best thing to do is to get your mech to take the covers off and check the cam timing. If it's only a tooth or two, refit a new belt and try it.
If it's still running roughly, then it's damaged the engine.

In this thread you can see more details and photos of the cam belt in place.


Please let us know how you get on.

[Emme0810]

Thanks Col, I understand it better now!
Well, the car hadn't been running roughly until a few nights ago. The car had been cutting out for a while, but it would start right up again and drive without an issue.
So! What I'm really hoping for is that it is a tooth and that there is no damage. I drove the car with shuddering to get it home, but it wasn't even a mile. So fingers crossed that I got away with it.
The mechanic is changing the belt tomorrow (so I suspect he sees a fault) and going to try the car then. I'm hoping it does, I can afford for a new belt but not a new engine! I have no idea when the belt was last changed, I've had the car for two and a half years and done 27000 miles in it. I was hoping that the garage I bought it from had changed it before selling it but it seems unlikely now. I shall be more vigilant in future!
I shall update tomorrow but fingers crossed for me please!

[Capncol]

It actually wasn't due (10years/80,000miles) But you can have problems earlier if a belt tensioner or something similal goes faulty.


Fingers crossed

[Rivis]

I have no idea when the belt was last changed, I've had the car for two and a half years and done 27000 miles in it. I was hoping that the garage I bought it from had changed it before selling it but it seems unlikely now. I shall be more vigilant in future!

The recommended service interval for changing the cambelt is 80,000 miles or 5 years (whichever comes first), so I reckon when you first got your car it hadn't quite reached that.

I've got my fingers crossed for you, keep us posted.

[Capncol]

Where did you get 5 years from? Everything I have including autodata are still saying 10 years.
http://www.mytimingbelt.com/Results.aspx?ModelId=20

[Enright]

I hope you can get away with this repair not costing any more than £250-300. That would probably be the going rate for a timing belt change from a garage assuming there was no other damage.

[Rivis]

Where did you get 5 years from? Everything I have including autodata are still saying 10 years.
http://www.mytimingbelt.com/Results.aspx?ModelId=20

from the 206info forum FAQ - I did think 5 years seemed too low, happy to be corrected

http://www.206info.co.uk/Forums/viewtopic/t=104.html

Every 80,000 miles (120,000km) or five years - whichever is soonest.

Renew the coolant,
Renew the timing belt.

[Emme0810]

Well!
The official diagnosis is that the starter motor is buggered completely! That's why the car wasn't even starting and shuddering along. But, he did notice that the belt is looking a bit worn. My car is coming up for 9 years old, so he's gonna change it for me as he also thinks that's why the car was cutting out in the first place. By the way, this was all after a heart attack, because my partner thought it funny to tell me that I needed a whole new engine! B*****d!
So basically, the belt is worn but not broken so that's why the car was cutting out before. Then the starter motor packed in which caused the car to shudder along and then eventually not start at all. Altogether, I'm looking at £200 for labour and parts but this is mates rates. I'd hate to think how much it would've been at another garage!
Thank you to everyone who has given me advice through this ordeal! I hope to get my car back by Friday, if not Monday. I may put a picture of my baby up as it's the only way I can thank everyone and show how much this car means to me.